ARIN PPC at NANOG 62 Notes - 07 October 2014

Table of Contents

Opening and Announcements

Speaker: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Transcript

John Curran opened the meeting and welcomed those in attendance. John began the Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 62 by making meeting-related announcements and introducing those at the head table. He reviewed the meeting rules, agenda and the Discussion Guide. At the beginning of the meeting, approximately 62 people were in attendance. John moderated the policy discussions during the event.

[ARIN offered the opportunity for remote participation throughout the meeting. Comments from remote participants are read aloud at the meeting and are integrated into the meeting report. There were 8 registered remote participants.]

Update on Advisory Council Activities

Speaker: John Sweeting, ARIN Advisory Council Chair
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

John Sweeting provided an update on Advisory Council activities. He reviewed the current docket of draft policies and proposals.

  • Introduced the AC members in the room – see them if you want to talk policy outside this session
  • One Recommended Draft Policy – is this ready to go to Last Call?
  • Nine Draft Policies and one new proposal
  • There is a room reserved after this session if anyone wants to continue discussing any policy topics, see any AC member for assistance

There were no comments or questions from the floor at the conclusion of the presentation.

Recommended Draft Policy ARIN-2014-9: Resolve Conflict Between RSA and 8.2 Utilization Requirements

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Scott Leibrand, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

John Curran presented an introduction to the proposal noting that this policy is a recommended draft.

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Heather Schiller and Scott Leibrand
  • Introduced on PPML in January 2014 (ARIN-prop-199)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 60, ARIN 33, and at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61
  • Advanced to Recommended status in July 2014, now seeking to confirm community support

Scott Leibrand presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Request for community input

Scott moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • What action would ARIN take if the recipient entity on an 8.2 transfer doesn't actually qualify for the space that the source is seeking to transfer?
  • What is the difference between "return" and "reclaim"?
  • What happens if someone doesn't qualify for an 8.2, and they refuse to return resources?
  • Because the RSA overrides the policy language, what value is there in having this language in the NRPM?

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

At the end of discussion, John Curran asked for a show of hands to determine those in favor of this recommended policy proposal (remote participants were invited to participate). After the tally was conducted, John stated that this information would be provided to the Advisory Council for use in its deliberations.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-6: Remove 7.1 [Maintaining IN-ADDRs]

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Rob Seastrom, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background:

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Robert Seastrom
  • Introduced on PPML in January 2014 (ARIN-prop-198)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 60, ARIN 33, and at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

Rob Seastrom presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text  - this proposal has been updated to include removal of 6.5.6 so that it applies to both IPv4 and IPv6
  • This is seen as operational practice, but do we want to remove this from the NRPM before it is fully documented elsewhere?
  • Request for community input

Rob moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Don't believe removal of the policy text is dependent on completion of operational practice document.
  • Disagreement on the view that this is strictly operational info. It should remain in the policy text.
  • Will ARIN be changing its services with regard to IN-ADDR maintenance if this policy is adopted?
  • The existing policy text does not actually reflect operational practice as it stands.

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-15: Allow Inter-RIR ASN Transfers

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Scott Leibrand, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Scott Leibrand and David Farmer
  • Introduced on PPML in May 2014 (ARIN-prop-205)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

Scott Leibrand presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Potential implications for RPKI that need to be considered
  • Request for community input

Scott moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Detailed explanation of why ASN transfers create a unique issue for RPKI
  • Is there sufficient community benefit for the work needed to enable this transfer capacity
  • Absent an argument in favor, there will be a motion to abandon this proposal during the AC's meeting following ARIN 34

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-14: Removing Needs Test from Small IPv4 Transfers

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: John Springer, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Andrew Dul and John Springer
  • Introduced on PPML in May 2014 (ARIN-prop-204)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

John Springer presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Is this ready to move to recommended status? Does it require additional work, or should it be abandoned?
  • Request for community input

John moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Shepherd intends to suggest this proposal move to recommended as it is not "unfair", "unsound" or "unsupported"
  • Policies that encourage transfers are good, would prefer to remove all needs-basis for transfers
  • Workload for ARIN staff should not be a justification for policy decisions
  • Should policy factor in original allocation size when determining the requirement for apply needs-basis?
  • Would prefer to start with a smaller boundary for needs-basis removal to get some operational impact on this change.
  • Policy doesn't impact market behavior, so we shouldn't maintain or create policy that complicates maintaining the accuracy of the ARIN database.

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-20: Transfer Policy Slow Start and Simplified Needs Verification

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Kevin Blumberg, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Kevin Blumberg and David Farmer
  • Introduced on PPML in September 2014 (ARIN-prop-212)
  • This is the first discussion of this draft policy at an ARIN Public Policy Consultation

Kevin Blumberg presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of the text
  • Request for community input

Kevin moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Seems like there is too much happening in this policy, should be broken out into separate elements
  • Policies for transfers and free pool allocations should not be different
  • It appears that transfers can be entirely justified on future projections, not historical use
  • Don't want to do anything that further codifies needs-basis or utilization requirements for transfers

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-1: Out of Region Use

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: David Farmer, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Milton Mueller and Bill Darte
  • Introduced on PPML in January 2014 (ARIN-prop-192)
  • This draft policy was discussed during the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 60, ARIN 33, and at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

David Farmer presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Review of the staff and legal assessment
  • Request for community input

David Farmer moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • We need to be thoughtful about how we define in-region and out-of-region use, this has long range impacts, not sure we want to commit to the definitions used in this text
  • Is the testing for in-region or out-of-region use different? How will RSD validate out-of-region requests?
  • Does this infringe on the rights of our RIR peers?
  • The intent of the policy is good, but there are some text issues that need to be resolved before this moves forward.

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-16: Section 4.10 Austerity Policy Update

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Dan Alexander, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Dan Alexander and Cathy Aronson
  • Introduced on PPML in May 2014 (ARIN-prop-207)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

Dan Alexander presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Current version of this proposal addresses the community desire for an austerity provision in the text
  • Considering abandoning this proposal unless there is clear support
  • Request for community input

Dan moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Show of support for abandoning this proposal, need to acknowledge and accept the limitations of the free pool
  • Unless we are willing to split the reserve pool this policy doesn't really work, absent that we should abandon

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-17: Change Utilization Requirements from last-allocation to total-aggregate

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Andrew Dul, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Andrew Dul and Owen DeLong
  • Introduced on PPML in May 2014 (ARIN-prop-209)
  • This draft policy was discussed at the ARIN Public Policy Consultation at NANOG 61

Andrew Dul presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Should this wait until the free pool is depleted?
  • Should this include a requirement that every block be utilized at least 50%
  • Should we limit this to include organizations that have at least /18 total-aggregate
  • Request for community input

Andrew moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • Clarification provided on the 50% requirement
  • Setting a /18 limit seems unfair and burdensome for larger organizations with efficient practices
  • Unless we put this in before run out occurs, it won't matter and it won't help the organizations that need this policy

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-18: Simplifying Minimum Allocations and Assignments

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Rob Seastrom, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Rob Seastrom and Tina Morris
  • Introduced on PPML in July 2014 (ARIN-prop-210)
  • This is the first discussion of this draft policy at an ARIN Public Policy Consultation.

Rob Seastrom presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • How does this impact other policy?
  • Considering abandoning in the absence of clear support
  • Request for community input

Rob moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • This problem is being solved by small organizations who are opting to go to other RIRs to get space
  • Shouldn't this be limited to new entrants, as written anyone can take advantage of the policy
  • All organizations should bear the burden of the IPv6 transition equally, as such all organizations should have equal access to the remaining IPV4 pool.
  • With the implementation of /24 minimums, this is no longer needed.

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Draft Policy ARIN-2014-19: New MDN Allocation Based on Past Utilization

Introduction: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Speaker: Andrew Dul, ARIN Advisory Council
Presentation: PDF
Transcript

Background

  • Advisory Council shepherds: Cathy Aronson and Andrew Dul
  • Introduced on PPML in September 2014 (ARIN-prop-211)
  • This is the first discussion of this draft policy at an ARIN Public Policy Consultation.

Andrew Dul presented the text of the proposal and then the rationale.

  • Rationale for the proposal
  • Overview of text
  • Request for community input

Andrew moderated discussion.

Discussion highlights:

  • It seems like the policy trend is all about putting limits on growth, and this seems to support that trend.
  • Conversely – this policy makes it easier for new MDNs, and as such should be supported
  • "Evidence of deployment" is a problematic term – it needs to be clarified and agreed upon or replaced with something less open to interpretation

For discussion details, please see the transcript.

Closing Announcements and Adjournment

Speaker: John Curran, ARIN President and CEO
Transcript

John Curran thanked everyone for their participation and encouraged them to plan on attending ARIN 34 later this week. He also invited attendees to join us for the next PPC at NANOG 63 in San Antonio next February and at ARIN 35 in San Francisco in April. He noted that the feedback from all the policy discussions would be provided to the AC for their consideration.